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	<title>Comments on: Random Lantern-related thoughts</title>
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	<link>http://www.greenflame.org/2006/10/15/random-lantern-related-thoughts/</link>
	<description>Jottings on science, religion, technology, pop culture and faith from the Antipodes.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 16:33:39 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: ConradGempf</title>
		<link>http://www.greenflame.org/2006/10/15/random-lantern-related-thoughts/#comment-584</link>
		<dc:creator>ConradGempf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 20 Oct 2006 18:31:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.greenflame.org/wordpress/2006/10/15/random-lantern-related-thoughts/#comment-584</guid>
		<description>Yeah, I'm with you on all of this.

The difference between this and the O'Neil-Adams revolution was that then we were recognizing that there was stuff accepted as "normal" that was actually sin. Hal's mission and morality had to expand beyond physical heists to fight systemic robbery and socio-economic oppression. But now we're shrinking his morality -- stuff he used to think was wrong suddenly isn't any more.

I'd love to believe that this was part of a larger character development arc that will have him "swinging" back (unfortunate term there...) toward the middle, but I'd have wanted him to vocalize the change as O'Neil and Adams did. And, as a writer, I'd have the Ollie Queen character foreshadow the later return rather than just smirk and wink "hope I'm not interrupting something" or whatever he said (I gave the issue away already).

But, yeah, great call on the AirForce thing. And I think the long term Bruce Wayne - Hal Jordan antagonism is one of the best new wrinkles in there since I was a kid.
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, I&#8217;m with you on all of this.</p>
<p>The difference between this and the O&#8217;Neil-Adams revolution was that then we were recognizing that there was stuff accepted as &#8220;normal&#8221; that was actually sin. Hal&#8217;s mission and morality had to expand beyond physical heists to fight systemic robbery and socio-economic oppression. But now we&#8217;re shrinking his morality &#8212; stuff he used to think was wrong suddenly isn&#8217;t any more.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d love to believe that this was part of a larger character development arc that will have him &#8220;swinging&#8221; back (unfortunate term there&#8230;) toward the middle, but I&#8217;d have wanted him to vocalize the change as O&#8217;Neil and Adams did. And, as a writer, I&#8217;d have the Ollie Queen character foreshadow the later return rather than just smirk and wink &#8220;hope I&#8217;m not interrupting something&#8221; or whatever he said (I gave the issue away already).</p>
<p>But, yeah, great call on the AirForce thing. And I think the long term Bruce Wayne - Hal Jordan antagonism is one of the best new wrinkles in there since I was a kid.</p>
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		<title>By: Stephen</title>
		<link>http://www.greenflame.org/2006/10/15/random-lantern-related-thoughts/#comment-583</link>
		<dc:creator>Stephen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Oct 2006 21:01:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Yes, it annoyed me too. That bit of the characterisation was odd - especially given how all the other characters (and writers) talk of Hal as having a strong moral centre and clear ideas of right and wrong. I guess they are redefining some of that in terms of contemporary values - as comic books have done in every generation (c.f. Adams and O'Neil's run on GA/GL in the 70s).

Still, I wonder if some aspects of the characterisation are overdone attempts to redefine the character. The original hotshot, flyboy test pilot who had a way with the women tended to get lost over the years as Hal became more introspective and aware of various shades of grey and social issues. And they seem to be bringing that back.

In part, it may also be Hal "rediscovering" his youth (seeing as he's been de-aged at bit) and also a reaction against his recent past. Parallax corrupted Hal's sense of right and wrong into absolutes that had him trying to establish a "justice" in the world, and the Spectre incarnation also played on that. Maybe he'll swing back into the middle somewhere?

On the other hand I can't stand the fact that he signed up with the Air Force. 1) The Corp should support you when you join, and 2) you can't serve two masters. Just idiot story writing, I think.

Liked the Batman/Hal Jordan issue a while back though. That seemed to capture some of the character well.

It will be interesting too to see where the DC Universe goes. The company/writers etc. have said they thought the 80s-early 2000s moved far too much into dark and gritty stories and lost some of the wonder and fun that the stories used to have. Post Infinite Crisis they're going to try and bring some of the light back (All Star Superman is a good example. All Star Batman is not).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, it annoyed me too. That bit of the characterisation was odd - especially given how all the other characters (and writers) talk of Hal as having a strong moral centre and clear ideas of right and wrong. I guess they are redefining some of that in terms of contemporary values - as comic books have done in every generation (c.f. Adams and O&#8217;Neil&#8217;s run on GA/GL in the 70s).</p>
<p>Still, I wonder if some aspects of the characterisation are overdone attempts to redefine the character. The original hotshot, flyboy test pilot who had a way with the women tended to get lost over the years as Hal became more introspective and aware of various shades of grey and social issues. And they seem to be bringing that back.</p>
<p>In part, it may also be Hal &#8220;rediscovering&#8221; his youth (seeing as he&#8217;s been de-aged at bit) and also a reaction against his recent past. Parallax corrupted Hal&#8217;s sense of right and wrong into absolutes that had him trying to establish a &#8220;justice&#8221; in the world, and the Spectre incarnation also played on that. Maybe he&#8217;ll swing back into the middle somewhere?</p>
<p>On the other hand I can&#8217;t stand the fact that he signed up with the Air Force. 1) The Corp should support you when you join, and 2) you can&#8217;t serve two masters. Just idiot story writing, I think.</p>
<p>Liked the Batman/Hal Jordan issue a while back though. That seemed to capture some of the character well.</p>
<p>It will be interesting too to see where the DC Universe goes. The company/writers etc. have said they thought the 80s-early 2000s moved far too much into dark and gritty stories and lost some of the wonder and fun that the stories used to have. Post Infinite Crisis they&#8217;re going to try and bring some of the light back (All Star Superman is a good example. All Star Batman is not).</p>
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		<title>By: ConradGempf</title>
		<link>http://www.greenflame.org/2006/10/15/random-lantern-related-thoughts/#comment-582</link>
		<dc:creator>ConradGempf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Oct 2006 20:33:23 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Thanks for the link to the interview.

Gotta say, I really had serious issues with stuff like the reformed Hal sleeping around with people and not even remembering their names... The idea of superheroes completely caving in to the cultural norms of the moment when I knew them as gallant and honorable for years is ... dunno.

Hey, gimme a break, it's tough getting old.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the link to the interview.</p>
<p>Gotta say, I really had serious issues with stuff like the reformed Hal sleeping around with people and not even remembering their names&#8230; The idea of superheroes completely caving in to the cultural norms of the moment when I knew them as gallant and honorable for years is &#8230; dunno.</p>
<p>Hey, gimme a break, it&#8217;s tough getting old.</p>
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